Want to learn jazz?

Have you seen my latest Blues Course - Slow 60 Blues?

Author Topic: Not particularly good ...  (Read 3630 times)

Vladan

  • http://vladanmovies.blogspot.com
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 687
  • High on own Supply
    • View Profile
Not particularly good ...
« on: June 11, 2015, 09:48:23 AM »
... it does not belong to Recording Studio, to backing tracks either,  so ....

Fitting notes of the GMaj7 (G B D F#) over FMaj7 (F A C E) chord vamp.
Trouble notes being F#, somewhat less B, G is pretty pleasant 9, while D is 6 (or 13) regular substitution for Maj7.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAVNJnXWtVM

zagatron1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1522
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2015, 01:00:47 PM »
Sounds like you got comfy in a certain area on th' neck. I used to do that when attempting to play to music like that. Still do as a matter of fact. Worse, I don't even know th' notes I play by name and probably would not play it th' same way twice. It's fun to experiment tho'. I mean, that's what it would be I where to tackle that tune.  ::)  For th' hell of it, I tried messin' around in th' key of "C". 

 BTW, good job!
« Last Edit: June 11, 2015, 01:30:30 PM by zagatron1 »

robert

  • Guitar Guy
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1387
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2015, 06:17:35 PM »
Yeah, F# is a bad one indeed. You can play F Lydian over that F vamp, same notes as C major scale.

Vladan

  • http://vladanmovies.blogspot.com
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 687
  • High on own Supply
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2015, 03:49:37 AM »
It seem to vary from person to person how open, or adaptable their ears/ brain combos are. For me, in above example F# is too far out when played in isolation and let ring to fade. However, within a figure, even as simple as alternating it with D, it has it's place, giving an unusual, but not overly strange sound. And even further, alternating F# and B still sound good for me, especially if there's a path led before it to prepare the ear, like gradually altering lines from "all in" to " as far out as acceptable". In above example it was D F# sequence leading to B F# one. It does sound superimposed, but in a good way, IMO.
In fast runs it's just a passing color tone, I've no problems with that way of using it.

BTW, originally this started as a talk about hearing melodies related to chord extensions, as if extensions were "the chords" and melody being from the key of that chord, something like that, lines resolving to extension notes. I tried to simplify the thing, as in look on C extensions, being from a G major scale, followed by "if a tune is in C and G is good enough for it (as Robert said giving Lydian sound), then, since FMaj7 is also in C there must be some way to stay in G over FMaj7. So, this FMaj7 originally is in the key of C.
However, once turned into 1 chord vamp all odds are off, there are no more keys, or anything, it's just a modal vamp without function and everything's strictly intervallic.

For further thinking and possible try outs, being in modal state, having no more background to hold us back, we can pronounce FMaj7 tonic chord and try to build something functional over it, while still using G major as pool of notes to build lines. Why not?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2015, 03:53:21 AM by Vladan »

robert

  • Guitar Guy
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1387
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2015, 10:47:38 AM »
Yeah, ANY notes can be made to sound good. It's all about the phrase, or statement made (lick)... there are no bad notes - I take that back! All 12 are good ones, it's just a matter of how you put them together to make something sound good.

In fact, sometimes when I practice, I play in and out of different keys on purpose, just to get used to the change in harmony. It's harder than it should be. :)

zagatron1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1522
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2015, 09:01:19 PM »
I go by a little saying when I try stuff. I'll think about what I'm tryin' to do, then tell myself "it has to make MUSICAL sense", if that even makes any sense. You'll know if you're on track if it sounds good to your ear. As far as that FMaj7, B, F#, G over this, that and the other, well it's all Greek to me. I'm an ear guy, so I have to go by what "sounds" like it makes sense.

I've learned playing in a "crude" way for so long, it would be like starting all over again to try an' learn that stuff the right way. Here's a situation where I'd like to donate some advice, but I don't even know how to convey the point. I use the root AND my ears to even get in th' ballpark. Like for example, isn't a major 7th chord the triad with an added major 7th tone, or something like that? Man, I don't know. That theory stuff escapes me. Duh! ???

Vladan

  • http://vladanmovies.blogspot.com
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 687
  • High on own Supply
    • View Profile
Re: Not particularly good ...
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2015, 08:00:25 AM »
Yeah, ANY notes can be made to sound good. It's all about the phrase, or statement made (lick)... there are no bad notes - I take that back! All 12 are good ones, it's just a matter of how you put them together to make something sound good.

In fact, sometimes when I practice, I play in and out of different keys on purpose, just to get used to the change in harmony. It's harder than it should be. :)

You are absolutely right.

I go by a little saying when I try stuff. I'll think about what I'm tryin' to do, then tell myself "it has to make MUSICAL sense", if that even makes any sense. You'll know if you're on track if it sounds good to your ear. As far as that FMaj7, B, F#, G over this, that and the other, well it's all Greek to me. I'm an ear guy, so I have to go by what "sounds" like it makes sense.  ...

Basically, the theory is a lingo used to draw some contoures about what's already done. It can all be explained in "plain English" only in a bit less concise manner, that's all. Even less, as there are sometimes many different nomenclatures for one same thing, so people end discussing and debating in circless, endlesly. Ear, brain and fingers, that is what's important, "the rest is ... jack talking (Dave Stewart https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY5P5F3IYoQ , so now there's some really good music)".